Barry Adamson, as you may be aware, played bass for Magazine and Nick Cave's Bad Seeds -- an impressive musical pedigree, to be sure. Accordingly, when Adamson struck out on his own in the late eighties in hopes of one day becoming a film composer, success was on the cards. His debut, Moss Side Story, was jaw-droppingly good -- an intoxicating and occasionally disturbing mixture of rock instrumentation, found sound, shapeless ambient sound, sound effects and deconstructed vocals (from Diamanda Galas, no less). It blew a lot of people away.
Over the years, Adamson has done his share of film work, from penning the score to Alison Anders's Gas, Food, Lodging to providing music for David Lynch's Lost Highway. He's also built up an impressive body of cinematically-oriented solo work, from 1992's Soul Murder to 1998's As Above, So Below. But it's the newly-released The King of Nothing Hill that could truly give him his break...
Adamson has been on my personal "Must Interview" list since 1989, when Moss Side Story abruptly changed my idea of what an album could be and do. While I could've talked to the man all day (much to his label's chagrin, given that they were kind enough to cover the trans-continental telephone hookup), I had only thirty minutes, and therefore did my best to confine myself to the topic at hand, The King of Nothing Hill. Adamson's enthusiasm for his new record was truly refreshing -- this is a guy who, without a trace of arrogance or self-absorption, really enjoys creating and performing his music and loves nothing more than sharing it with others, particularly newcomers. He wants to tap into the human spirit, hacking straight through to the memories and emotions and making the sort of visceral connections that make you feel.
In other words, Barry Adamson wants to direct your Big Picture. He doesn't just sing about "Cinematic Soul" -- he is one.
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Splendid: King of Nothing Hill comes on the heels of a four-year break. Other than the obvious high-profile work, what have you been up to?
Barry Adamson: A few things. I spent a little bit of time out after As Above, So Below -- did a few movies, and got involved in a television series, so I've spent many months and many moons trying to apply myself in the craft of scoring. I did all those studio things because after As Above, So Below I kind of had some medical problems -- I had to have a hip replacement, which was the last in a series of three...
Splendid: Ouch!
Barry Adamson: It got a little crazy, so initially, any studio work that came in, I did. There was animation, short films, commercials, all sorts of stuff. Then, probably about two years ago, I said "Right. Time to do another album." And I'd used the time, as well, to sort of recuperate and develop the ideas, and so I kind of sat down and made out a plan, really. It looked sort of like eighteen months to a year -- a year to eighteen months that became a couple years due to one thing or another. So it all adds up at the end of the day, but for me it's like time's been flying by. I remember sitting down and saying "Right! Time to start a record. I think I've got something cooking."
Splendid: That's good. So you've been doing a lot of scoring-type work...and I've always thought of you as someone who should be doing a lot of soundtrack-oriented work. So you are, and it just isn't making it overseas?
Barry Adamson: Exactly. Obviously there's a whole scene going on in Europe that doesn't really leave Europe, and I kind of got involved in some of that. I've gotten involved in the independent scene here, as well. I've sort of hooked up with an animation company that does very moody and sort of dark pieces, and I enjoy doing that. As far as "worldwide" awareness...the last thing I did was work on the movie The Beach -- I remixed, I did some score, and some production of Angelo Badalamenti's score as well. So that was the last prominent thing. But it's funny -- I'm quite happy with my own little niche, my own little European thing. Some of the independents in America I check on -- you know the website Film Threat?
Splendid: Oh, yeah.
Barry Adamson: So if the independent stuff comes out in America, fantastic. I never really wanted to go for the full-on Hollywood composer deal, really.
Splendid: Too restrictive?
Barry Adamson: I think for me, for the kind of musician I am, I'd just be doing them and myself a disservice, really. Unless the tide kind of changed and came my way. For example, to see someone like David Fincher employing the Dust Brothers -- if there was more of that kind of thing going on, sure. But I think people like to play safe, with a sort of backdrop of orchestral music in a certain thriller genre, anyway. There could be room for a lot more interest and investigation in terms of using electronic music as something slightly left of center for thriller and mystery films. I don't think it's really being done. They've settled on a classical orchestral thing and don't really move from there. That's "the way"
AUDIO: Cold Comfort
Splendid: I consistently amazes me, for example -- and for some reason I mention this with a lot of Mute artists -- that David Arnold never picks up the phone when it's time to score the next Bond film and says "Hey, Barry Adamson, why don't you come work on this?"
Barry Adamson: Then again, I think that is a kind of different schooling -- that's kind of classical-leaning in possible training. I don't know. Maybe part of me has kind of kept myself out of that; there was a time when that's something I could've done, but I think the thing that's different now is that I've got another career going, which is my own albums, and sort of plunging into the depths of cinematic reference, if you'd like -- shaping a kind of world in a movie that's my own. That kind of makes up, really, for the part of me where I've been truly committed. I think it's a decision you make -- that you go "Right, I'm going to learn everything I can, and apply my craft and do it." And you only have to go to Hollywood and see every other guy that's doing it.
Splendid: Right, but they're all hacks, right?
Barry Adamson: A lot them are, but there's always one who comes through. There's always something. Don't forget, some of them are probably as crazy about film as we are, and they're just trying to get a foot in the door. It's not easy.
Splendid: So how do you go about writing? Because you have such an extended instrumental palette, how do you go about putting together something where you have horns involved, and so forth? A lot of your instrumentation sounds like it's "real" as opposed to sampled.
Barry Adamson: I do actually use a mixture of real and sampled. I love the idea of a sampler being almost like a memory, or if it was from a movie, something that you might just catch a little of, out of the corner of your ear, so to speak -- like a melody or a little groove thing that you might pick up while you're in a car or something, or it might go past you. I love this way of using samples, where you kind of "grab" a mood. I think the way I write is actually from a purer, almost film-making process of emotion.
I actually have to have a certain thing in place -- like The King of Nothing Hill was a definite sort of portrayal of an idea of an emotional place that I seem to land in occasionally. It's kind of like another window on the other works, really -- Moss Side Story, Oedipus, etc. It's me finding something inherently human, and kind of feeling out of sorts with that emotion, and then trying to connect that to the rest of the world, to make sense of that. So what I do then is characterize that -- and it's no coincidence that the sleeve of the record is a portrait, because that's what it is -- it's a portrait. It's an emotional idea, about separation and connection in the world. And I've made this guy king, so you're thinking "Oh, this is the guy in charge," but he's alone... I'm kind of gravitating towards this place right in the middle of the record.
I kind of know all that before I've even picked up an instrument, and then I kind of trust that what's gonna come out is going to be working to this. It's like my "spine", if you like. So I'll kind of be referring back to this all the time, making reference to this idea. And I think because I'm in that place, then the words that come out will be to do with it, or at least I can start to fashion them that way. Then I'm, like, directing myself -- like "Oh, no, no, pull back a little bit there," or "Time for a little humor there." That kind of stuff. So I get it up and running like that.
Splendid: That makes sense. It seems like you must have some kind of storyboard in place --
Barry Adamson: It's not an obvious one. I think that'd be too hokey on a record. Like, track four: (He sings) "And then we went to the King's house..." That sort of stuff. But there is...
Splendid: There's a definite sort of dramatic through-line there, emotionally.
Barry Adamson: Yeah, there's an emotional through-line from the middle of "Twisted Smile" through "Paris" -- the "I love Paris track". I think it's like "The gates are open..." in the King's lair there, right there.
Splendid: And then you go into "That Fool Was Me", which is a nice pull back.
Barry Adamson: Yeah, kind of walk away a little bit.
Splendid: A lighter track.
Barry Adamson: Exactly. But then there's the Taxi Driver moment is "The Crime Scene" -- a look in the rear-view mirror.
Splendid: It basically distills an entire film into one song.
Barry Adamson: Yeah, exactly.
Splendid: It's interesting, what you mentioned about the way you use samples. Obviously it's very different from the sort of lazy, "I don't know how to play that instrument so I'm going to use a sample" approach. I know exactly what you're talking about -- the "corner of the ear" thing.
Barry Adamson: Yeah, that little "Oh yeah!" moment of recognition. It provokes something. That's the emotion thing again, provoking and going "Oh my god, yeah!" And from that sound, you get a whole world that becomes almost a visual thing, if memory can be visual as well, or even if it's from the future. When you do that "Oh yeah," that's what gets me about it.
Splendid: When something like that gets you when you're listening to someone else's music, and it's a sample like that, are you satisfied with the emotional response or is there a part of you that says, "Okay, I have to figure out if that's really the sample I think it is!" Do you have to dig through soundtracks or anything like that?
Barry Adamson: No, I don't. Something happened to me the other day -- there's a kind of trip-hop reggae guy here called Roots Manuva --
Splendid: Got the new record right here on the desk, actually.
Barry Adamson: There's a brilliant track on the end of his new album, and I recognized straight away a sample from Richard Harris's "MacArthur Park" (from A Tramp Shining). It was this beautiful harpsichord. But because he's also singing about this almost fantasy idea of being at peace and at one, and this idea, this sort of pomp and ceremony of "Macarthur Park" at the same time -- it's beautiful. It got me in the stomach, because I didn't have to look into it any further than a piece of information I already knew about the song, which was explained to me within the piece.
Splendid: Emotional shorthand.
Barry Adamson: And I thought, "That's great. I don't need to worry about where that's from." There's a whole set of samples that makes you go "Uh-huh. That's something to do with that period of music." That other stuff, it's very interesting what you can actually do with it. But I'm not a sort of sample-o-phile, who has to find out what's what. I just get the stuff that I know.
Splendid: But it's nice to have that sort of contextual pop-cultural shorthand available when you need it.
Barry Adamson: Yeah! The reason I do the things I do is that hopefully it's a richer experience for the listener. Like listening to that record, I had a richer experience, because I was being affected, and these are the things that I actually get from a medium like cinema. I'm taken in. People are kind of acting their asses off, and I'm getting their emotions. So that's where I kind of walk in the door.
AUDIO: Cinematic Soul
Splendid: So, back to the album... You've mentioned that while the King is up on his own and kind of distant, the album -- especially "Cinematic Soul" comes across as much more intimate and unrestrained record. "Cinematic Soul" specifically speaks directly to the audience in a way that you haven't done before.
Barry Adamson: Exactly. And to me, it's kind of... I'm trying to do a traditional thing of setting up and paying off. Like the last record -- I'm almost kind of walking away from it, and kind of celebrating that I got through it. Like the end of the last record is kind of a car going into a wall, driving straight to hell, and I walk away from it. And then I kind of question -- am I walking away? Did I actually die and I'm born again? God, I'm royalty this time! Jesus, wow! And I can hear the soul, kind of floating around and trying to find me, and then it's like the thing starts whirring up, and whoa! Time to move. There's all this optimism that I'm bringing to the table, which I think is... this is a way for me to say, in the traditional sense, to say okay, I'm back, I'm here, we're gonna have a good time, just trust me on this one. If you pay your money and sit in the dark with total strangers, you can trust this as well. Let me kind of guide you through or something. Put your seatbelt on, 'cos we're going on a carousel ride now... That sort of thing. I wanted a device, and also a quite genuine way to kick the thing off and make a big statement.
Splendid: It's definitely a big title sequence.
Barry Adamson: I think so. I'm glad you say that, 'cos it wells up and it swells up and I think it's got a great spirit.
Splendid: I had it on in headphones when I was out walking yesterday and I felt like I was in the middle of a film.
Barry Adamson: Ahh, great! I kind of think, and hope, that it's working on those levels. When someone says that, that's great.
Splendid: It's a song that makes you feel like you're wearing a suit, no matter where you are. I assume that that's really your son on the song?
Barry Adamson: Yes it is. Yes it is.
Splendid: How did that come about?
Barry Adamson: It's funny, 'cos he was around the studio and stuff, and I could see his face kind of light up watching what was going on, and the rest of it. And I just thought, the idea of the opening track, it's kind of like this fearlessness -- like before, you're kind of, like, taught all the stuff in the world, and he has that. He leaps out of the bed and there's no question that he's up for whatever's going to go on and all the rest of it. He doesn't sort of cautiously go "Oh, okay...I've gotta go to my job now." That spirit, I wanted to bring that to the table. So I asked him if he would, and he said yeah, and he had a great time.
Splendid: That's great. How old is he?
Barry Adamson: He's ten.
Splendid: Has he been really involved in your music in the past? Has he had much of an awareness of it?
Barry Adamson: Not really. I think he sort of thinks of it as "what dad does over there." I think, as he's getting a little older now, that he's putting two and two together. And also hearing things as well, and catching things on the radio occasionally, or seeing something. I'm just waiting for the moment now, in a couple of years, when he totally turns his back and rolls his eyes and goes "Dad, my god!" That's when he'll get into...I don't know, whatever version of Slipknot is happening then.
Splendid: Boy, I hope not. That would be a shame.
Barry Adamson: Well, I think he's allowed that. I certainly went through something like that. I'm sure you did, right?
Splendid: Yeah... It always seems like the next generation comes up with something proportionately worse, though, doesn't it?
Barry Adamson: Yeah. That's how it is, though. You've gotta expect that. They've gotta find something --
Splendid: You've got to rebel somehow.
Barry Adamson: Yeah, something that's going to kick back against you.
Splendid: I think "Cinematic Soul" -- and I don't mean to dwell on the track, but it struck me as really significant, and I listened to it so many times -- because I don't think I've ever heard you have fun on a song before, so obviously and so blatantly. I could almost envision the whole thing being done in a single take. If I ever was going to see the Barry Adamson Live Experience, which I still hold out hope for before I die, I figure this would be what it would be like.
Barry Adamson: Yeah, you've got it. It does kind of encapsulate that stuff more. I did a kind of -- what would you call it? -- "public address" thing last week -- just six songs. Me and a DAT player, very loud, jumping around and all the rest of it. And I opened with "Cinematic Soul"; when we play live I'm gonna open with "Cinematic Soul". There's just something about that song that sets a tone, so the other stuff after it, even if it's dark, has more of a fun texture to it than just "Okay everybody, let's get ready to rock." There's something about it that actually brings out more of my essence than before. As I'm getting closer to it, it's getting easier for me to open the door on it and not so much put a mask over that. Which is clever, as well. Something's been masked before, and I'm discovering certain things about myself and my work. And the King is dead, long live the King. The thing that I kind of thought about -- this idea of loneliness and being bathed in resentment and self-pity -- that stuff is kind of going from my life, and I'm kind of finding new ways... Like I said long live the King, he's the guy in "Cinematic Soul", and the one who accepts that okay, this is how it's been in life, but from now on it's going to be very different in "Cold Comfort". So that's really the portrait, if you'd like, in a nutshell.
Splendid: Is it also -- and I promise this'll be my last question about this song -- are you kind of tweaking the noses of everyone who's ever reviewed your music by giving "Cinematic Soul" that title? It's certainly a phrase I've seen used as a description.
Barry Adamson: I'd not thought of it that way. I wanted something that said, right off the bat, that if you'd never heard me before, if you didn't know anything about me, but maybe someone said "You should check this guy out, he's got this film thing going" or whatever, then I wanted it to be as plain as day what it was about. But I wanted it to also say something that I didn't really say, or maybe hinted at, in The Negro Inside Me -- the whole thing is the idea of truth and illusion, and where the soul steps into all of that. I'm kind of fascinated by these kind of ideas, and I look for stuff that talks about this. And do we make film because it's a truer portrayal of life than we think? It also stands the test of time instead of dying, so it's kind of soul-like in that way, that it lives on. These things are sort of an open question, but that's where I kind of came into it.
Splendid: Moving on, then... "Black Amour" -- could you have made that song earlier in your career?
Barry Adamson: I think so, yes. Actually, I think around the time of The Negro Inside Me I had the same kind of idea.
Splendid: I know there are similar songs on The Negro Inside Me --
Barry Adamson: Not like this, though.
Splendid: No, not developed to this extent.
Barry Adamson: In irony. And facetiousness. And downright fucking around with a genre and making it my own, and also being quite cheeky and stealing and taking things... I probably would've made a different version of it back then, but I think I kind of nailed it with this one.
Splendid: I can tell you're very satisfied with The King of Nothing Hill as a whole, but what do you think is the most indelible and obviously visual moment on the disc?
Barry Adamson: Last night I was putting some of the things together for the live "experience", because it'd be very expensive to have a full orchestra and brass and string-players and all the rest of it. So I was going into the sound file and taking bits from it that we can "fire off" at will. And then I was putting the New Orleans brass section together for "That Fool Was Me", and I had it in the studio just playing on its own, and on one of the channels on the desk, the reverb was left up, so it sounded slightly in the distance. And I was like, "Oh my god!" So I think it's a beautiful moment in the record, where there's me talking about loss, but saying at the same time that this loss is a grieving moment for the King who's dead. In a way, by talking about these relationships I'm actually talking about myself. And so there's a moment when the New Orleans band strikes up, which is almost like a celebration as well -- Long Live the King! And I think, wherever you are in your life, that moment in the second verse just touches something. It's one of my favorite moments, because it throws in this funereal kind of lilt, and at the same time picks it up. I love the way it hangs beautifully between those two worlds.
AUDIO: That Fool Was Me
Splendid: Yeah, it's a neat song. I can imagine hearing that portion would be striking.
Barry Adamson: Probably live I'm going to use just that portion and sing. I'm not sure how -- obviously it doesn't come across as powerful as that because the whole thing's separated, but I liked it.
Splendid: How often have you been out live with your material?
Barry Adamson: Not that much. I did spend, like, five or six years almost locked away, really, in the studio, trying to digest as much as I could in the early days after Moss Side Story. And then, when As Above, So Below was happening, I saw the potential. It's almost gone full circle, really, moving away from rock instruments altogether for Moss Side Story just to find out what it was I wanted to do, to just kind of coming back around. I've found that I was able to see a little more how I'd be able to do the whole thing live, and I started to do a little bit more, but then the series of hip operations was a killer. 'Cos that's, like, four years of work just kind of gone, from getting out and doing much live. So now that I've got that all sorted out, it's time to make up for lost time. I've not been out a lot.
Splendid: Will you be touring widely behind King? D'you think you'll make it to the US?
Barry Adamson: I don't know. I've got a European tour scheduled for October, then there's going to be a break, and then we'll see what's going on. It's very possible that January and February I might get out to America. I'd really like to. What I really want to do is get the live unit up and running and then keep going. I've kind of committed to spend the next year, as long as it takes, to break this album, somehow. I think it's worth it. I think it's right. And before I've always been a bit "Well, we'll see how it goes..." But not this time. Something's changed with this one.
Splendid: The climate seems right, too.
Barry Adamson: It seems like it! I don't want to be arrogant, but if I stand away from it, I kind of go, "That record's good, and that record should break! That's right for that record!" It's just being objective and not really putting myself in the picture, but there's something going on. I don't know.
Splendid: I think it's a lot easier, also, in 2002, to build a community around any type of music than it's ever been.
Barry Adamson: I think so too. Moss Side Story was like, if you're not a sort of film aficionado, go away, y'know? You're not invited. And no I'm sort of saying "Come on!" It's gradually changing. I'm opening the door more and more.
Splendid: And purely due to the Net, more people will hear this album than have heard any album you've done before.
Barry Adamson: Yeah. Have you stopped by BarryAdamson.com yet?
Splendid: I did when I was working on my review of the record.
Barry Adamson: It only just started, like last week, so it's a little thin on the ground.
Splendid: How involved are you in the site?
Barry Adamson: Pretty much.
Splendid: It's a nice beginning.
Barry Adamson: A friend of mine is designing it, and he's e-mailing me every day. Like, "Okay, now you've gotta do this. Now you've gotta get this. Now you've gotta do that. And then when Murkyworld starts up, you've gotta do that. You've gotta send this... Get the video...
Splendid: There really are some great opportunities to extend your whole cinematic concept at a more manageable price.
Barry Adamson: Through the web?
Splendid: Right. People are doing very cinematic things on a shoestring budget on the web.
Barry Adamson: Yeah, we're doing something for "The Crime Scene" and we're just going to put it up there and see how it does. We'll run around, make it on our Macs, with a production cost of zero. You can do that now.
Splendid: Yes you can. You can make a movie in your car if you want.
Barry Adamson: That's true, isn't it? In your car.
Splendid: It's kind of scary. What will people be able to do in twenty years?
Barry Adamson: Wow.
Splendid: I've taken about half an hour of your time, so just to wrap up... is there anything you've been working on besides King of Nothing Hill that we're likely to see here in the States? Has any of your TV work made it over?
Barry Adamson: Probably not. There's a cop show called City Central, they did the first two series... That seems to be moving around the world. I've kind of been tracing it, like a friend called me from Australia and said "The show's on here," and a friend called me from Holland who'd seen it.
Splendid: Who's that for? Is it a BBC thing?
Barry Adamson: Yeah.
Splendid: That's good. They've been pretty aggressive with getting their better shows out on DVD here, so there's always that hope. Especially after hearing Negro Inside Me, I wished you'd do a cop show.
Barry Adamson: Exactly. It's very suited to that -- it's electronic, it's eighteen cues over a weekend, you get it done, you have no time, you're working on the fly...
Splendid: I recall NYPD Blue coming out shortly after Negro Inside Me, and thinking that the music they used sounded so much like yours. Not quite...but I wished they'd just call you and have you do it.
Barry Adamson: Yeah, that would've been fun.
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does too many interviews.
[ graphics credits :: header/pulls - george zahora | photos - steve gullick (provided by mute) :: credits graphics ]
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